aquarelle wrote:
I’m not looking for advice or a “what would you have done?”

You're not looking for advice, but by posting, you're implying that you are looking for some feedback, so here goes. I would have offered her a ride home. 2 hours on a bus/train commute is about 30 minutes by car.

You stated that the light was fading before you even started. I can't imagine what it would be like for her heading home in the dark of night with an infant in tow on public transportation. You're in the Chicago area; I've been there and the public transportation can be sketchy in the later hours. The fact that she risked it means that she was really desperate for cash.

Francisco Castro wrote:

You're not looking for advice, but by posting, you're implying that you are looking for some feedback, so here goes. I would have offered her a ride home. 2 hours on a bus/train commute is about 30 minutes by car.

Exactly. I would have given her a few bucks and sent her walking. I have -ZERO- respect or patience for people that waste my time and lie to me.

aquarelle wrote:
On the day of, she sent a number of texts telling me she was having transportation problems,

Major red flag #1. Instantly I would have insisted on rescheduling for another day.

“I’m so sorry!  But I’m almost there, and I’ve been on the bus and train for two hours.”

Major red flag #2

As I was watching for her out my studio window, I saw a woman who looked nothing like her crossing the street with a baby carriage.

Major red flag #3

She said “Did I tell you I was bringing my baby?”

Major red flag #4. Truly, at this point you should have stopped being a doormat and said, "I'm really sorry, this is absolutely not working out, I have a very bad energy about all of this, and I am very uncomfortable working with you at this point. Here is 50 bucks and best of luck to you."

As she undressed, she said, I also have some scars.  I hope that’s OK.”

No, it's not OK, and it's misrepresentation (at best). I had a model pull this on me once. I booked her for a shoot and she neglected to tell me that she had gained 50 pounds since all the photos in her portfolio were taken. I wasn't even so kind as to give her gas money I was so pissed.

There wasn’t much I could use.

I know you don't want to hear this but you already know it...you asked for this! I know for some people it's hard to say "no" to some people but you asked for this. Consider this a learning lesson.

Francisco Castro wrote:
I would have offered her a ride home. 2 hours on a bus/train commute is about 30 minutes by car.

+1

Shot By Adam wrote:
Exactly. I would have given her a few bucks and sent her walking. I have -ZERO- respect or patience for people that waste my time and lie to me.

Jesus christ. Aren't you fun.

There are ways to handle situations like this, and being an asshole is not one of them. I think the OP is very admirable for his reactions. He felt empathy for her. Should he be pissed? Absolutely. Would I have done what the model did? Nope. She was trying her hardest to get to work. Do you know how many people are struggling in this country? It's a shoot not a lifelong commitment. The whole point is a lesson and clearly showing character in a person. Let's just say there are two types of people so far in this thread.

Model Sarah wrote:
Jesus christ. Aren't you fun.

There are ways to handle situations like this, and being an asshole is not one of them. I think the OP is very admirable for his reactions. He felt empathy for her. Should he be pissed? Absolutely. Would I have done what the model did? Nope. She was trying her hardest to get to work. Do you know how many people are struggling in this country? It's a shoot not a lifelong commitment. The whole point is a lesson and clearly showing character in a person. Let's just say there are two types of people so far in this thread.

Agree. I would not do what the model did, but then again, I've also not been in desperate straits while being completely responsible for the life of a newborn child.
I can understand wanting to tell her off and being livid. But reacting with anger to a desperate person with a baby - the desperation was obvious from the initial interaction where she doesn't even do nudes but agreed to erotic to raise money fast - would be in very poor taste. A random young girl being dumb and showing up not looking like her photos, sure. Go off. This situation is different and sounds really unfortunate.
I would ask some people - would your gut instinct be to yell at this girl? There's something wrong that the best probiotic will never fix if so.

Even in the case you weren't going to work with her, I'd at least drive her home or give her travel money before, as kindly as possible, turning her down.

Liv Sage wrote:

Agree. I would not do what the model did, but then again, I've also not been in desperate straits while being completely responsible for the life of a newborn child.
I can understand wanting to tell her off and being livid. But reacting with anger to a desperate person with a baby - the desperation was obvious from the initial interaction where she doesn't even do nudes but agreed to erotic to raise money fast - would be in very poor taste. A random young girl being dumb and showing up not looking like her photos, sure. Go off. This situation is different and sounds really unfortunate.
I would ask some people - would your gut instinct be to yell at this girl? There's something wrong that the best probiotic will never fix if so.

Even in the case you weren't going to work with her, I'd at least drive her home or give her travel money before, as kindly as possible, turning her down.

Yep. I think his post is quite telling. I don't know about you, but when I see behavior like this on this site or anywhere, I remember the person and I warn other models about potential danger citing why.

My ONLY bad experience I ever had as a professional model of 18 years was similar to this guy. I showed up 15 minutes EARLY and the guy was livid. Like, VISIBLY livid. He proceeded to yell at me and berate me for "fucking his day up" I literally ran away from him as a gut instinct to my car crying. This behavior is just not acceptable and in my opinion, telling.

aquarelle wrote:
She explained that she is interested in erotic work if she has worked with the artist previously.  And she doesn’t list nude work, because it keeps the PMs  more manageable. 

I hope I didn’t infer that the model was offering to work in a genre in which she was uncomfortable because of her dire straights.  She was actually pretty uninhibited, and showed me some of her previous erotic work on her phone.

Also, I can take a train across the street from my studio and be in in the loop in 12 minutes, or the the suburbs in 20 minutes; driving to the same places at rush hour can easily take an hour.

Okay this all makes more sense now.
And yeah, I often forget about big cities (despite having been based in NYC for years). When I am offered uber/lyfts during rush hour in NYC, unless I'm carrying way too much stuff, I just take the train too.

aquarelle wrote:
I have a casting up that requires erotic nudity. 
....
Just sharing an example of one of my adventures on Model Mayhem.

Thank you for the story, it was quite entertaining.

Model Sarah wrote:

Jesus christ. Aren't you fun.

There are ways to handle situations like this, and being an asshole is not one of them.

Excuse me, you're totally out of line here and are taking the side of the asshole while calling me one. Let it be known that the MODEL was the "asshole" here for lying and misrepresenting herself.

I'm going to bet that if you saw an ad for something, went to go buy it only to find out that it was completely not what you saw in the ad, you'd buy it anyway, right? Of course you wouldn't, and you'd probably the first person to be screaming at a manager about bait-and-switch. It's no different here. Believe it or not, some people actually put a lot of time and energy in setting these things up and when people blatantly lie and misrepresent themselves, they don't deserve a lot of sympathy.

Imagine you got booked by a photographer and when you showed up to the shoot, he says he's not going to pay you now or if it's a TFP shoot, he completely lied about his portfolio or never delivered the photos. You know as well as I do that you'd be the first one in these forums screaming about it.

Liv Sage wrote:
Agree. I would not do what the model did, but then again, I've also not been in desperate straits while being completely responsible for the life of a newborn child.
I can understand wanting to tell her off and being livid. But reacting with anger to a desperate person with a baby - the desperation was obvious from the initial interaction where she doesn't even do nudes but agreed to erotic to raise money fast - would be in very poor taste. A random young girl being dumb and showing up not looking like her photos, sure. Go off. This situation is different and sounds really unfortunate.
I would ask some people - would your gut instinct be to yell at this girl? There's something wrong that the best probiotic will never fix if so.

Even in the case you weren't going to work with her, I'd at least drive her home or give her travel money before, as kindly as possible, turning her down.

,Disagree:
Infant on set is a hazard. First of all. For me and for itself (it's a petri dish, or it'll somehow "catch corona from my pet Llama" ,and now that's my fault... NOPE..
Secondly, bait and switch is never okay, misrepresentation is never okay, not from guys, not from women, not from models, photographers, MUAs, I don't care who you are. Bait and switches are some of the vilest practices out there, they cost time, resources, and, worst ofall, they cost faith in humanity.
Thirdly, while I (to an exrend, we've all had a rough time), I can crsympathize with the young mother, the crotch fruit is is not my responsibility, it's hers.

If I buy a product/ service, I only pay if it is as advertised,  otherwise it's a simple breach of.. whatever it is. Agreement, contract, etc.
If I book an appointment at (fill ijn facility), and I don't adhere to the rules/regulations/agreed upon standard, I will surely get turned away, otherwise why bother with an agreement in the first place. 

Hunter is more of a mensch than a great many of us, it's been abundantly evident from his well- handled arguments and adventures here..

The model is now an addition to the pile of DNR (Do Not Recommend) though.

OP wrote:
I don’t regret going on with it, though, because I sympathized with her circumstances, and I felt she was trying both to give me her best and raise money for her family of two.

huh. that is an adventure. I wonder what other things she's tried to raise funds in a short time, at least those things would have been consensual and not crossed anyone's boundaries, but I guess the manager didn't like her look at the audition.

Acraftman1313 wrote:
I spend a couple hours setting up different backgrounds ready to shoot and when she shows up her bodyguard? gets out opens the door for her ignoring me and after she introduces herself I ask is your companion dropping you off or waiting in the car. He says I'm coming inside the house. So I just sent them off since the last pair I had inside decided to do a private tour of my home while I was "downloading " the shoot for her to take with her.
There is no mention of a bodyguard on her portfolio so the question is I feel very tempted to tag a note mentioning this on her profile to prospective photographers as it seems pretty intentional and I did mention to her if it was stated in her port I would not have contacted her in the first place and two weeks later it is still not listed in her profile.

How did they take it when you turned them down? How did you put it?

Zap Industries wrote:
How did they take it when you turned them down? How did you put it?

I explained my reasons for not having two people in my house since my previous experience and the guy who was probably twenty-five at most told me don't worry he was a ex-cop , at which time I pointed to my neighbor who is a Sheriff mentioning he is still a cop as you can tell by his Sheriff's car in the driveway and they said okay got in there new Jaguar and left.

Acraftman1313 wrote:
I was going to start a new post but this is in a similar well actually not even close to the OP but I have a question I scheduled a paid shoot with a model who states she has five years of runway ,tv shows, videos etc. Great! I spend a couple hours setting up different backgrounds ready to shoot and when she shows up her bodyguard? gets out opens the door for her ignoring me and after she introduces herself I ask is your companion dropping you off or waiting in the car. He says I'm coming inside the house. So I just sent them off since the last pair I had inside decided to do a private tour of my home while I was "downloading " the shoot for her to take with her.
There is no mention of a bodyguard on her portfolio so the question is I feel very tempted to tag a note mentioning this on her profile to prospective photographers as it seems pretty intentional and I did mention to her if it was stated in her port I would not have contacted her in the first place and two weeks later it is still not listed in her profile.

I always thought it was a standard industrial practice that a model (particularly a female model turning up to a photography shoot with someone she doesn't know) would always have a friend along.

Call that friend what ever you like. A bodyguard, a chaperone, whatever. It was for all the obvious reasons why they would won't one. It seems odd to me that people expect it not to happen.

I kind of make it clear that the friend/bodyguard/chaperone has a place to sit out of the way and shut up and mind their own business - perhaps read a book or what ever. If they feel the need to be a busybody, then good, they can help out with positioning lights or if they are particularly tall enough, stick them somewhere with a hand held light to get an angle I can't with the fixed lights.

MatthewGuy wrote:

I always thought it was a standard industrial practice that a model (particularly a female model turning up to a photography shoot with someone she doesn't know) would always have a friend along.

Call that friend what ever you like. A bodyguard, a chaperone, whatever. It was for all the obvious reasons why they would won't one. It seems odd to me that people expect it not to happen.

I kind of make it clear that the friend/bodyguard/chaperone has a place to sit out of the way and shut up and mind their own business - perhaps read a book or what ever. If they feel the need to be a busybody, then good, they can help out with positioning lights or if they are particularly tall enough, stick them somewhere with a hand held light to get an angle I can't with the fixed lights.

They have to ask first though. No one should ever just show up with an escort. Let the photographer know first. I have done countless photoshoots, and so far no model has ever showed up with one. A few have asked though.

John Jebbia  wrote:
Jesus Christ! You allowed a child to be present during a nude/erotic shoot and then you admit it on a public forum? Oh let me count the ways this could come back to bite you in the ass in 6 months when baby daddy finds out.

John I missed your frank posts! Haha... I haven't been on MM in a while. But you said what we were all thinking. I've softened in my years after being away for a couple of years. But I love you are as blunt as always.

Samantha Grace wrote:
John I missed your frank posts! Haha... I haven't been on MM in a while. But you said what we were all thinking. I've softened in my years after being away for a couple of years. But I love you are as blunt as always.

Well I'll be damned. Long time no see. How you been?

aquarelle wrote:
On the day of, she sent a number of texts telling me she was having transportation problems, and it looked like we’d need to start about an hour and a half later than the set time.

As I was watching for her out my studio window, I saw a woman who looked nothing like her crossing the street with a baby carriage.  I said to myself, no that can’t be her!”  Well it was.  My bell rang and there she was with a four month old infant in tow.  She said “Did I tell you I was bringing my baby?”  I said no, and she asked if it was Ok.  I wasn’t sure if it was, but I said it was.  As she undressed, she said, I also have some scars.  I hope that’s OK.”

It's your fault that you accepted all of these things. I would have sent her back home.

Mark Salo wrote:

+1

+2

MatthewGuy wrote:
I always thought it was a standard industrial practice that a model (particularly a female model turning up to a photography shoot with someone she doesn't know) would always have a friend along.

No. It's a standard industrial practice that adult people do not bring a "friend" to work.
Otherwise offices and factory buildings would be overcrowded. Not to mention working safety and insurance questions...