Zura wrote:
For a sole proprietor model reporting taxes- does anyone know how to record cash payments from private shoots (i.e. a photographer who is practicing his craft and isn't an established business). Can this still be recorded into tax profits?

You simply write a bill including your tax number. And there should be a model release indicating the payment you get. It should me written in the model release that the payment is in cash. But basically I prefer models who accept bank transfer payments.

Manfred wrote:

You simply write a bill including your tax number. And there should be a model release indicating the payment you get. It should me written in the model release that the payment is in cash. But basically I prefer models who accept bank transfer payments.

No!  Do not give people your tax ID numbers- especially if you use you social security number instead of a federal EIN number.  You probably won't have an EIN unless you have employees, but you can get one on the premise that you will have employees.  I have never once put a tax ID number on an invoice in 33 years of being in business.

There is a possibility that someone could ask you for a W-9.  That would have either your EIN or SS number.  It is better to use your EIN.  After receiving your EIN, they should send you a 1099.  However, these are both unnecessary pieces of paperwork for most people- completely uncalled for if you are working with amateurs.

I have never asked for tax ID information from a model and have never provided 1099s.  I have never received an invoice from a model and would not expect to.  I pay cash on delivery. 

In my business, I sometimes provide an invoice if it is requested- usually not because I am paid in advance and the contract specifies all the terms and documents the transaction.  I get paid by check and it is very unusual that I have to provide any tax ID information- and then only to corporate clients and pita lawyers.

The government will compare your tax returns to records, like bank deposits, if you get audited.  If you keep a spread sheet indicating the name and source of each transaction, that should be plenty.  Cash businesses, like a restaurant, obviously don't keep tract of every cash customer's name.  You could list your income by date, but too much information is better than not enough. 

Don't live a lifestyle that is greater than your reported income!

Hunter  GWPB wrote:
No!  Do not give people your tax ID numbers- especially if you use you social security number instead of a federal EIN number.  You probably won't have an EIN unless you have employees, but you can get one on the premise that you will have employees.  I have never once put a tax ID number on an invoice in 33 years of being in business.

There is a possibility that someone could ask you for a W-9.  That would have either your EIN or SS number.  It is better to use your EIN.  After receiving your EIN, they should send you a 1099.  However, these are both unnecessary pieces of paperwork for most people- completely uncalled for if you are working with amateurs.

I have never asked for tax ID information from a model and have never provided 1099s.  I have never received an invoice from a model and would not expect to.  I pay cash on delivery. 

In my business, I sometimes provide an invoice if it is requested- usually not because I am paid in advance and the contract specifies all the terms and documents the transaction.  I get paid by check and it is very unusual that I have to provide any tax ID information- and then only to corporate clients and pita lawyers.

The government will compare your tax returns to records, like bank deposits, if you get audited.  If you keep a spread sheet indicating the name and source of each transaction, that should be plenty.  Cash businesses, like a restaurant, obviously don't keep tract of every cash customer's name.  You could list your income by date, but too much information is better than not enough. 

Don't live a lifestyle that is greater than your reported income!

I'd like to point out that a model doing nudes is already required to sign a 2257 release, which includes their social security number.  You said here that you use 2257 releases: https://www.modelmayhem.com/forums/post … st19968197
And if you are paying a model over $600 (total in a year) you are required to file a 1099.

Model MoRina wrote:
I'd like to point out that a model doing nudes is already required to sign a 2257 release, which includes their social security number.
And if you are paying a model over $600 (total in a year) you are required to file a 1099.

Thank you for bring these points up.  It is always good to have to review such matters.

You are right if a model is being paid over $600 a year from a business, the model should be prepared to supply a W-9 and receive a 1099.  But I don't, because hiring any model is outside the purview of my business.  "Businesses are required to issue a 1099 form to a taxpayer (other than a corporation) who has received at least $600 or more in non-employment income during the tax year." [1] Also, the $600 threshold is key.  I won't speak for others, but I rarely, if ever, do over $600 worth of shooting with any one model in a year. 

I can spend over $600 a year at one business- say maintaining small engines- but I do not have to send a 1099.  There is a list of situations in which a 1099 is required here:  https://www.irs.gov/forms-pubs/about-form-1099-misc

Most of my customers are not a business in any form. It is extremely rare for any of my customers to pay me less than $600 for my services, and of varying numbers of customers each year, I may get one or two 1099s.  Those are from other businesses that are passing through a payment from their client to me, or they are a business where I was a direct business expense.  And attorneys, as noted.  (Last tax season I had an attorney demand a W-9 from me and I refused because he was not my client.  He had reimbursed my client for work that he benefited from, but he was not my client.  I received zero funds from him directly and my actual client was the one obligated to send a 1099.  His 1099 would have indicated a different source of money that would have appeared to be additional money.  If he needed to send anyone a 1099, it was the person he gave the funds to.)

In hiring a model, for me anyway, it is not a business expense.  If I am not claiming it as an expense, it is not any of the IRS's concern how much money I spend on models any more than how much money I spend on ice cream, ... or stable fees. (Horses are expensive!)  I make no effort to sell paintings and if I chose to do a commission piece, which I am way to busy to do, the customer has never been a business entity, so I have never gotten a 1099, and I can "Use [a separate] Schedule C (Form 1040) to report income or loss from a[n art] business you [ I ] operated or a profession you [ I ] practiced as a sole proprietor. An activity qualifies as a business if: (1) Your primary purpose for engaging in the activity is for income or profit. (2) You are involved in the activity with continuity and regularity," and as such, neither condition is true for my art.  Ultimately, I show my accountant everything I made each year and everything I spent and she handles the paperwork, which has never included a single 1099 going out. (I do the W-2s myself.)

As for 2257, the act says "producers of pornography, or depictions of any sexual activity using actual people, are required to verify that the performers are of legal age (18–years–old or older) by maintaining records of the performers’ names and ages."  I usually photograph the driver's license, which is tied to the social security number at the DMV and the government can access that, but I can't.  I have never asked for a SS number from a model.  Unless I see it written in the law somewhere, or case law, I am not going to ask for it, because I am not engaging in a business activity (at this time) photographing paid models..

Maybe I am doing it wrong.  Please show me something that I have missed in the law or case law which requires a SS# for shooting porn- (which I also don't do).  2257 is not required for doing art nudes, but I understand the reasoning in getting the form signed in any nude scenario because there is ambiguity in the wording as to when it is required and it is open to the exaggeration of prosecutors with an agenda.

I looked at various 2257 forms that are available on line and some have a space for SS#s.  Some don't.  Here is one of them: https://apagunion.com/wp-content/upload … ms-PDF.pdf


(a)Whoever produces any book, magazine, periodical, film, videotape, digital image, digitally- or computer-manipulated image of an actual human being, picture, or other matter which—
(1)contains one or more visual depictions made after November 1, 1990 of actual sexually explicit conduct; and
(2)is produced in whole or in part with materials which have been mailed or shipped in interstate or foreign commerce, or is shipped or transported or is intended for shipment or transportation in interstate or foreign commerce;
shall create and maintain individually identifiable records pertaining to every performer portrayed in such a visual depiction.
(b)Any person to whom subsection (a) applies shall, with respect to every performer portrayed in a visual depiction of actual sexually explicit conduct—
(1)ascertain, by examination of an identification document containing such information, the performer’s name and date of birth, and require the performer to provide such other indicia of his or her identity as may be prescribed by regulations;
(2)ascertain any name, other than the performer’s present and correct name, ever used by the performer including maiden name, alias, nickname, stage, or professional name; and
(3)record in the records required by subsection (a) the information required by paragraphs (1) and (2) of this subsection and such other identifying information as may be prescribed by regulation.
https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/18/2257

[1] https://www.investopedia.com/financial- … 1099s.aspx
https://www.irs.gov/businesses/small-bu … ion-return
https://www.justice.gov/criminal-ceos/1 … ifications


other sources:   https://www.gdnlaw.com/practice-areas/i … 28-cfr-75/
Here are a few definitions that are especially important:

§ 75.1 Definitions.

(b) Picture identification card means a document issued by the United States, a State government, or a political subdivision thereof, or a United States territory, that bears the photograph, the name of the individual identified, and the date of birth of that individual, and provides specific information sufficient for the issuing authority to confirm its validity, such as a passport, Permanent Resident Card (commonly known as a “Green Card”), or employment authorization document issued by the United States, a driver’s license or other form of identification issued by a State or the District of Columbia; or a foreign government-issued equivalent of any of the documents listed above when the person who is the subject of the picture identification card is a non-U.S. citizen located outside the United States at the time of original production and the producer maintaining the required records, whether a U.S. citizen or non-U.S. citizen, is located outside the United States on the original production date. The picture identification card must be valid as of the original production date.

Hunter  GWPB wrote:
Thank you for bring these points up.  It is always good to have to review such matters.

You are right if a model is being paid over $600 a year from a business, the model should be prepared to supply a W-9 and receive a 1099.  But I don't, because hiring any model is outside the purview of my business.  "Businesses are required to issue a 1099 form to a taxpayer (other than a corporation) who has received at least $600 or more in non-employment income during the tax year." [1] Also, the $600 threshold is key.  I won't speak for others, but I rarely, if ever, do over $600 worth of shooting with any one model in a year. 

I can spend over $600 a year at one business- say maintaining small engines- but I do not have to send a 1099.  There is a list of situations in which a 1099 is required here:  https://www.irs.gov/forms-pubs/about-form-1099-misc

Most of my customers are not a business in any form. It is extremely rare for any of my customers to pay me less than $600 for my services, and of varying numbers of customers each year, I may get one or two 1099s.  Those are from other businesses that are passing through a payment from their client to me, or they are a business where I was a direct business expense.  And attorneys, as noted.  (Last tax season I had an attorney demand a W-9 from me and I refused because he was not my client.  He had reimbursed my client for work that he benefited from, but he was not my client.  I received zero funds from him directly and my actual client was the one obligated to send a 1099.  His 1099 would have indicated a different source of money that would have appeared to be additional money.  If he needed to send anyone a 1099, it was the person he gave the funds to.)

In hiring a model, for me anyway, it is not a business expense.  If I am not claiming it as an expense, it is not any of the IRS's concern how much money I spend on models any more than how much money I spend on ice cream, ... or stable fees. (Horses are expensive!)  I make no effort to sell paintings and if I chose to do a commission piece, which I am way to busy to do, the customer has never been a business entity, so I have never gotten a 1099, and I can "Use [a separate] Schedule C (Form 1040) to report income or loss from a[n art] business you [ I ] operated or a profession you [ I ] practiced as a sole proprietor. An activity qualifies as a business if: (1) Your primary purpose for engaging in the activity is for income or profit. (2) You are involved in the activity with continuity and regularity," and as such, neither condition is true for my art.  Ultimately, I show my accountant everything I made each year and everything I spent and she handles the paperwork, which has never included a single 1099 going out. (I do the W-2s myself.)

As for 2257, the act says "producers of pornography, or depictions of any sexual activity using actual people, are required to verify that the performers are of legal age (18–years–old or older) by maintaining records of the performers’ names and ages."  I usually photograph the driver's license, which is tied to the social security number at the DMV and the government can access that, but I can't.  I have never asked for a SS number from a model.  Unless I see it written in the law somewhere, or case law, I am not going to ask for it, because I am not engaging in a business activity (at this time) photographing paid models..

Maybe I am doing it wrong.  Please show me something that I have missed in the law or case law which requires a SS# for shooting porn- (which I also don't do).  2257 is not required for doing art nudes, but I understand the reasoning in getting the form signed in any nude scenario because there is ambiguity in the wording as to when it is required and it is open to the exaggeration of prosecutors with an agenda.

I looked at various 2257 forms that are available on line and some have a space for SS#s.  Some don't.  Here is one of them: https://apagunion.com/wp-content/upload … ms-PDF.pdf


(a)Whoever produces any book, magazine, periodical, film, videotape, digital image, digitally- or computer-manipulated image of an actual human being, picture, or other matter which—
(1)contains one or more visual depictions made after November 1, 1990 of actual sexually explicit conduct; and
(2)is produced in whole or in part with materials which have been mailed or shipped in interstate or foreign commerce, or is shipped or transported or is intended for shipment or transportation in interstate or foreign commerce;
shall create and maintain individually identifiable records pertaining to every performer portrayed in such a visual depiction.
(b)Any person to whom subsection (a) applies shall, with respect to every performer portrayed in a visual depiction of actual sexually explicit conduct—
(1)ascertain, by examination of an identification document containing such information, the performer’s name and date of birth, and require the performer to provide such other indicia of his or her identity as may be prescribed by regulations;
(2)ascertain any name, other than the performer’s present and correct name, ever used by the performer including maiden name, alias, nickname, stage, or professional name; and
(3)record in the records required by subsection (a) the information required by paragraphs (1) and (2) of this subsection and such other identifying information as may be prescribed by regulation.
https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/18/2257

[1] https://www.investopedia.com/financial- … 1099s.aspx
https://www.irs.gov/businesses/small-bu … ion-return
https://www.justice.gov/criminal-ceos/1 … ifications


other sources:   https://www.gdnlaw.com/practice-areas/i … 28-cfr-75/
Here are a few definitions that are especially important:

§ 75.1 Definitions.

(b) Picture identification card means a document issued by the United States, a State government, or a political subdivision thereof, or a United States territory, that bears the photograph, the name of the individual identified, and the date of birth of that individual, and provides specific information sufficient for the issuing authority to confirm its validity, such as a passport, Permanent Resident Card (commonly known as a “Green Card”), or employment authorization document issued by the United States, a driver’s license or other form of identification issued by a State or the District of Columbia; or a foreign government-issued equivalent of any of the documents listed above when the person who is the subject of the picture identification card is a non-U.S. citizen located outside the United States at the time of original production and the producer maintaining the required records, whether a U.S. citizen or non-U.S. citizen, is located outside the United States on the original production date. The picture identification card must be valid as of the original production date.

The 2257 form you linked does indeed have a space for SS# in section C on page 2. Look, I'm not the 2257 police. I don't actually give a rat's patootie what you personally do. I'm just correcting the bad info you gave earlier. You have stated you ask your models to sign 2257 forms, even though here you claim you don't need them. I live in the real world of selling my work and I'm going to go with what I know. When I modeled for others I was always required to sign a 2257 that included my SS# and give my id to be photographed. Sometimes I was required to fill in a W-9. It also requires my social security number. So, for you to say a model should never give their social security number out is bad information.

Model MoRina wrote:
The 2257 form you linked does indeed have a space for SS# in section C on page 2. Look, I'm not the 2257 police. I don't actually give a rat's patootie what you personally do. I'm just correcting the bad info you gave earlier. You have stated you ask your models to sign 2257 forms, even though here you claim you don't need them. I live in the real world of selling my work and I'm going to go with what I know. When I modeled for others I was always required to sign a 2257 that included my SS# and give my id to be photographed. Sometimes I was required to fill in a W-9. It also requires my social security number. So, for you to say a model should never give their social security number out is bad information.

I do request a 2257 even though I don't need them. So what?  How is that relevant?  I also explained why I use them.  Which was something I learned here in the forums.

I included a copy of a 2257 form.  I did not state that one didn't have a place for a social, I said some do and some don't. I picked that one because of the instruction sheet. That one also has a requirement for a witness.  I did not say that a model should not put her social on a 2257 form, but I did say that it is not a requirement.  I did ask you to show me a reliable source as to where a social is required on a 2257.  You have not.  I believe that is bad information on your part- and I wait to be shown otherwise.

I also photograph DLs,.  Photo IDs are required and if the government needs a social, the DL is tied to it.  Social Security numbers are not required per the statute.  Is it hard to understand that some people would require more than the law requires?  Kind of like why I do 2257s even though I believe that what I do doesn't require them?  ("Anyone can refuse to disclose his or her number, but the requester can refuse its services if you do not give it. Businesses, banks, schools, private agencies, etc., are free to request someone's number and use it for any purpose that does not violate a federal or state law. Sometimes they will issue a different number if you ask."  from SSA)

I did not say that a model should never give out her social security number.  I did say that the EIN is a better choice.  I did say that putting a social on an (every) invoice is a bad idea.

I did say a W-9 might be required.  I did say a 1099 might be required, but they are not required with every transaction totaling over $600 a year.  You have not disputed that.

If I am sharing bad information, fine.  Correct me.  But use verifiable facts, please.   A social is a sensitive piece of information and it shouldn't be given out without a real need.

I live in the real world too, Mo.  One where facts matter.

This is straight from the act:
(b) Any person to whom subsection (a) applies shall, with respect to every performer portrayed in a visual depiction of actual sexually explicit conduct-

(1) ascertain, by examination of an identification document containing such information, the performer's name and date of birth, and require the performer to provide such other indicia of his or her identity as may be prescribed by regulations;

(2) ascertain any name, other than the performer's present and correct name, ever used by the performer including maiden name, alias, nickname, stage, or professional name; and

(3) record in the records required by subsection (a) the information required by paragraphs (1) and (2) of this subsection and such other identifying information as may be prescribed by regulation.
https://uscode.house.gov/browse/prelim@ … on=prelim. punch in 18 under title and 2257 under section

OP, ultimately, it always better to get legal advice from lawyers rather than people using their own experiences and interpretations.

Hunter  GWPB wrote:
OP, ultimately, it always better to get legal advice from lawyers rather than people using their own experiences and interpretations.

Disclaimer;  I am NOT an attorney!  Even a tax attorney would say speak to them directly as every case could be different.  As a hypothetical, I would say that unless you are getting large sums of cash payments from someone you know is reporting the shoot as a business expense, a smaller amount of cash is very difficult to track without records.  Do what you feel is best.  End of discussion.