TXPhotog wrote:
Commercial print isn't about "models", it's said to be about "real people doing real things".  Neither "real people" nor "real things" is meant; it really means "better than average, but believable people, doing things the way we would ideally do them."

alartz wrote:
Murphy you definitely know what you're talking about!  I do commercial shoots as well.  eg.  check link out:  https://www.modelmayhem.com/pics.php?id=222592


Expression is a must.  If the models don't have that high fashion look then yep you got it, Lifestyle is the way to go for me.

Thanks Alartz.  Your port is chock-a-block full of commercial lifestyle stuff.

SWEETFACELA wrote:
I was trying something out but would this CONCEPT work well as commercial?

Yes. the image is not strong but the concept of "fitness/wellness/health/workout" is a fine commercial concept.  Consider bigger smiles or some more action oriented shots.

MurphyMurphy Studios wrote:

Yes. the image is not strong but the concept of "fitness/wellness/health/workout" is a fine commercial concept.  Consider bigger smiles or some more action oriented shots.

kewl! Thankscha!

bridgetisstillbored wrote:
Is there someplace we can look to see who does commercial stock photography in our state?  I'm in Chicago and don't know where to find many.

Chicago is a large print market. 

One way to find commerical lifestyle photographers is to look at ports here.  Another way is to go to the major stock house's websites and search.... it is an imperfect way to go but as it likely will not find many of the photographers, it will get you started.  Here is Getty:
http://creative.gettyimages.com/source/ … rchAS.aspx

Also read this thread to a post I made on "pounding the pavement".

Daniel_W wrote:
bump

Ouch. Watch where you swing that thing.

MurphyMurphy Studios wrote:

Yup.

Being a commercial model is not easy and still takes a lot of work and "hustle".   But, it is also the kind of work that you can do through the different phases of your life.

My biggest challenge right now is finding OLDER models.  MM is full of lovely

Lynn Louise wrote:
Wish I was in Atlanta as I'd love to shoot some commercial shots with you!!

And if you were I would work with you in 3 seconds.

MurphyMurphy Studios wrote:
And if you were I would work with you in 3 seconds.

Don't tease me like that!  lol.....I really want to get into Commercial/lifestyle modeling, but there doesn't seem to be any such thing in Harrisburg, PA!  Maybe I should move to GA.....:-)
I LOVE your work!

Lynn Louise wrote:
Don't tease me like that!  lol.....I really want to get into Commercial/lifestyle modeling, but there doesn't seem to be any such thing in Harrisburg, PA!  Maybe I should move to GA.....:-)
I LOVE your work!

You would be very surprised.  Look at local circulars or ads for Mom&pop stores, health clubs, coffee shops, bakeries, home decor stores, eateries, bowling alley's, and even things like electrians and plumbers.  Many of these run ad campaigns and many of them will use local talent. 

My sister (not a model but well connected in her community) has done a couple of print ads and a calendar -- just for fun.  All through networking with local business men and woman.

Read this thread about tips for finding local work.  Will it make you rich?  Nope.  But, you might very well become very recognized on the street in Harrisburg.  "Hey, aren't you the woman from the ABC decor store ad?"

MurphyMurphy Studios wrote:

You would be very surprised.  Look at local circulars or ads for Mom&pop stores, health clubs, coffee shops, bakeries, home decor stores, eateries, bowling alley's, and even things like electrians and plumbers.  Many of these run ad campaigns and many of them will use local talent. 

My sister (not a model but well connected in her community) has done a couple of print ads and a calendar -- just for fun.  All through networking with local business men and woman.

Read this thread about tips for finding local work.  Will it make you rich?  Nope.  But, you might very well become very recognized on the street in Harrisburg.  "Hey, aren't you the woman from the ABC decor store ad?"

I'm always looking, but I never see anything!  Guess I have to dig deeper!   Thank you so much for all your help....if I ever come your way, I'll be sure to look you up!
Thanks again....

RSM-images wrote:
I respectfully disagree that fashion shots are "about the model" as the OP's article reads.

My article isn't about fashion shots, does not say that fashion or anything else is "about the model", but other than that the comment is well taken.

The article is about "commercial print", not fashion, and the point being made is that commercial print shots are about the role being played, not about the model.

RSM-images wrote:
It seems that the aloof/sullen air and fashion pout, used everywhere by fashion models, became popular in the fashion genre that the viewer would *not* be engaged by the model and would, therefore, be drawn to the fashion.

This thread isn't about "fashion" and how fashion photography works.  Be that as it may, the point of "the pout" has nothing at all to do with "drawing the viewer to the fashion", but rather establishing the relevant emotional setting of the picture in which the fashion is portrayed.  Still, that is the subject for some other thread.

RSM-images wrote:
That said, a fashion model should have good facial features and good skin, but *not* a distracting glamour figure (except for certain fashion genres such as swimwear and lingerie).

Again, this thread is not about fashion.  Anyone who reads it as being about fashion, fashion modeling or fashion models, has completely misunderstood what the subject is.  Please go back and re-read the article.

RSM-images wrote:
I think fashion shots are "about the fashion".

And I think they are not - at least often are not - but that doesn't matter, since this thread is not about fashion.

It seems hard to get people to understand that there is more than one kind of mainstream modeling.  This thread is about a kind of mainstream agency modeling that is NOT "fashion".

Johnny Panzo wrote:
How about this one?



Or this one?

Well, I would not say that either of these are especially "commercial".  My take is that the first one "could be" if the model was "smiling having fun putting her shoe on."  But, keep in mind that the "set" of a commercial shot is also very important.  You usually don't see red seemless in a commercial shot (white, yes. Black, yes. Red or most other colors, no).  It can happen but, it is just not especially common.  If you had changed the background to white and had the model smile and had her pose in a lovely, natural way "fixing her boot", it would become a more commercial image.  Also, consider a little more "conceptual" crop.... a little tighter, shoot it on an angle, model laughing....

Second image.  This is far too glam.  The look on the models face is glam (not commercial).  Ask yourself this question..... what is the model "doing" (what "part" is she acting) in this image?  Glam shots don't worry about this question.  They take a pretty girl and drape her on a car.  The girl is selling sex appeal.  Commercial shots need to sell something other than sex.  They need to capture attention and convey emotion. Take this gal, have her:  Stand with her back towards you and looking at the jewelry in the window "window shopping".  Angle the shot sho you can see both the car and her "excited" face.   Also, try getting right up on the window and shoot the girl's face, in profile "window shopping" with the car reflected in the glass.  (Also, if you intend to try to sell the image commercially, don't forget to get a property release from the store owner if you are going to prominantly display that jewelry in the image AND the owner of that car).   There are a bunch of ways to shoot a good commercial image with the props that you had that day -- but, start with having the model lose the glam look, then, set a stage, have the model create "believable" expressions (not easy to do) while acting a believable "part", and shoot away.

oldguysrule wrote:
neat. this thread hasn't disappeared into nonsense yet.

Absolutely, I was thinking that! TX is the T - Rex in this 'Jurassic Mayhem' lol. This cookie knows his stuff. He's the man I would ask if I was stuck about anything from contracts to photographic preferences for specific projects. Whether the guy has time to assist will be treated with total respect in any case. Because of an enjoyable bout I had with him on one of my very first threads I am restructuring various parts of my website and totally separating certain aspects of my business that didn't quite gel. Ok, lets keep the thread on topic, It's not about fashion nor praise

MurphyMurphy Studios wrote:
Well, I would not say that either of these are especially "commercial".  My take is that the first one "could be" if the model was "smiling having fun putting her shoe on."  But, keep in mind that the "set" of a commercial shot is also very important.  You usually don't see red seemless in a commercial shot (white, yes. Black, yes. Red or most other colors, no).  It can happen but, it is just not especially common.  If you had changed the background to white and had the model smile and had her pose in a lovely, natural way "fixing her boot", it would become a more commercial image.  Also, consider a little more "conceptual" crop.... a little tighter, shoot it on an angle, model laughing....

Second image.  This is far too glam.  The look on the models face is glam (not commercial).  Ask yourself this question..... what is the model "doing" (what "part" is she acting) in this image?  Glam shots don't worry about this question.  They take a pretty girl and drap her on a car.  The girl is selling sex appeal.  Commercial shots need to sell something other than sex.  They need to capture attention and convey emotion. Take this gal, have her:  Stand with her back towards you and looking at the jewelry in the window "window shopping".  Angle the shot sho you can see both the car and her "excited" face.   Also, try getting right up on the window and shoot the girl's face, in profile "window shopping" with the car reflected in the glass.  (Also, if you intend to try to sell the image commercially, don't forget to get a property release from the store owner if you are going to prominantly display that jewelry in the image AND the owner of that car).   There are a bunch of ways to shoot a good commercial image with the props that you had that day -- but, start with having the model lose the glam look, then, set a stage, have the model create "believable" expressions (not easy to do) while acting a believable "part", and shoot away.

Thanks.

Models don't really like to shoot commercial. Example: I've ask models to pose with cell phone or sitting and talking on an old style corded phone. Some have refused. These are shots I can easily sell to phone or phone card companies or any business that want you to "call now".

I have the model in the car laughing, and you are right, I picked the glam photo to post in my profile here at MM.

Both these shots are based on actual shoes store advertising. And first one is cropped tighter, like you said. halfway up the boot (remember that poster with the model wearing a white skirt and cowboy boots and hat and white background?) These were cropped for the model's portfolios. And shot very high resolution so clients can crop them and still retain image quality. This shot is not to focus on the boots but on the pants.

Johnny Panzo wrote:
Thanks.

Models don't really like to shoot commercial. Example: I've ask models to pose with cell phone or sitting and talking on an old style corded phone. Some have refused. These are shots I can easily sell to phone or phone card companies or any business that want you to "call now".

I have the model in the car laughing, and you are right, I picked the glam photo ....

Well, as for models "not wanting to shoot commercial", that is a communication issue between you and the model.  If the shoot is a commercial shoot and the model agrees to it, why would you change it?   

Keep in mind that commercial modeling is VERY hard for a model.  Creating a lively yet believable expression is very difficult.  Putting on "bedroom eyes" (i.e. the "glam look") is a lot easier for many female models. 

Finally, I agree with you..... Judging from the portfolios on MM there are not many models (or photographers) that create commercial images.

Lestari wrote:
What about this?





will this pass ?

Links don't seem to work

Matrix Photography wrote:
Why would you search an amateur chat site like MM?

ummm, you are PPOC certified and you are here.  Are you saying that there are no professionals on MM?  Hmmmm, if so, there are at least 10 photographers right off the top of my head that I will need to email and tell them to leave.

Matrix Photography wrote:
You're not going to get the best stuff for free....

True.

Now, back to the topic of the basic differences between commercial print and fashion.

Jason P Hunt wrote:
Other places to shop yourself would be radio stations, especially rock formats. They might have calendars, personal appearances, etc. Here in Kansas City, KYYS has the KY Calendar girls. Maybe not completely commercial, but it's a possible market. A lot of universities do calendars, too. They need photogs.

Also, check with local merchant's associations. They sometimes will put out marketing material for all the stores in the group.


My questions:
- how easy/difficult is it to get commercial work with newspapers? I know they have people on staff, but how much of that work is done by stringers?
- what's the generally accepted rate for a comm photog in a mid-size market?

And here we bump again.

Jason, your local newspapers might not be a bad place to start. The key to getting them to accept your work (besides have a good set of photos to market) is to find them a good story, and present both the story and the photographs. I don't mean chase ambulances and firetrucks, either.

I did this a couple of years ago, researching and writing a story on a local sport aviation group. I then went on a cross country flight with several members of the group, taking photos along the way. The story and photo CD were presented to the newspaper unannounced (I was told that they did not accept outside submissions). The CD was left with the assistant editor, contrary to most advice you will hear.

One week later, three of the photos were published (my story was re-written, I'm not a good reporter), but I was offered a stringer position with the paper. Not bad considering that this newspaper has a circulation of over 1 million.

The thing to remember is that editors are always looking for material on leisure activities and local associations. Most of their reporter's time is taken by more immediate needs in the areas of local events, emergency runs and crimes committed on any particular day. A good story and set of photos could end up saving their day when it's time to put the Sunday issue to press.

This type of work could get you credits in the paper for your photos, and help to start your photography career.

Jason P Hunt wrote:
My questions:
- how easy/difficult is it to get commercial work with newspapers?

Very hard.  Work for newspapers (with very little exception) is "editorial", not "commercial".

Jason P Hunt wrote:
My questions:
- how easy/difficult is it to get commercial work with newspapers? I know they have people on staff, but how much of that work is done by stringers?
- what's the generally accepted rate for a comm photog in a mid-size market?

And here we bump again.

Jason.... lets not confuse the terms.... "working for a newpaper" is not "commercial work" in the context of this thread..